Supportive emails re Age Of Consent and legal sexual activity awareness.
Refer to main file at
www.geocities.com/queerradio/AgeOfConsent.htmOn 7th August 2000 I sent an
email to as many supportive people as I knewThese are emails received in response to the question:
Should accurate information about legal sexual activity involving 16 and 17 year-old persons be readily available &/or accessible to the general public?
I have to admit that this is a relatively low priority for me. The higher priority would be getting equal age of consent for all sexual activities. However, if the information was distributed in a form to target both, I would be for it.
I just don't see the point in telling everyone, "Hey! Did you know that you can do everything except anal when you aren't 18 (and above 16)? Yey!"
We should be saying, "There is variation in the age of consent law for certain sexual activies. Anal sex is illegal, for anyone, until the age of 18. Other activities are legal at the age of 16. This should be changed!"
Daniel England
7th August 2000
As the coordinator of the Australian Bisexual Network, a network of bisexual men and women and the partners of bisexual people, it is ABN's belief that people should have access to quality and correct information and that should apply equally in relation to legal status regarding age of consent and sexual activites.
It is the responsibility of Government and our Government Departments and services to provide accurate and up to date information that is available to the public in relation to laws of this State.
We would certainly welcome information that made the legal situation of age of consent laws in Queensland, clear to all members of the public.
Wayne Roberts
aussiebi@eudoramail.com 7th August 2000
Allow me, John, to show my hand. I think you should pursue this.
I think that you will find that the reason there is no accurate knowledge of this law is because it is not one of those laws that are meant to be enforced uniformly, rationally and fairly. It is an unfair law, created specially for those situations where you want to treat people unfairly. For instance marijuana prohibition. I would be very surprised is less than 50% of QLD parliamentarians have not inhaled within the last 12 months. However I would be very surprised if they were to be charged for this. Marijuana prohibition exists solely to discriminate against people who are already in trouble with the police, just as witchcraft made it easier to understand, and condemn, social protest in the 15th and 16th centuries.
Terry Sullivan was lying to you. There are far better reasons to discriminate against people than a simple lack of complaint.
Anyway, you have heard this all before.
Scott Grimmett
slg@powerup.com.au 8th August 2000
The issue of age of consent is very imporatnt and relevant to me personaly. I have had friends go to jail because they were unaware of the laws concerning
sodomy and age of consent.
As a queer male I strongly support not only the dissemination of information regarding the current laws relating to the age of consent, but also advocate
the lowering of the age of consent to bring it in line with our heterosexual counterparts...I would also add that I consider the age of 16 as being a little too high in certain circumstances.
shane garvey
shane_garvey@hotmail.com 9th August 2000
Yes! Definetly! As a gay 17yr old this kind of stuff would be very helpful... instead of just going out and doing it to find out.
munkus00@hotmail.com 9th August 2000
I'd like to show my hand in support of age of consent awareness. I'm gay, 16 years old, and although it's pertinent to me, even I am not completely sure that what I think is the age of consent, actually is.
Elwyn Moir.
Elwyn_au@hotmail.com 14th August 2000
On 15th August, after only receiving limited response to the first email I sent
another, this time with an "urgent" flag and a request for receipt. I received some excellent statements:
This letter is by way of support for education re the age of consent laws in our state. In my role as Queer Sexuality Resource Organiser (recently appointed) at University of Queensland I work with both students and staff many of whom are misinformed regarding the laws. However I have found similar misinformation in the wider community.
An example: Over the last 12 months myself & Lance Haines conducted professional training regarding effective work with GLBT young people. We provided training to approximately 150 professionals who work with with young people. The training was provided here in Brisbane, Toowoomba, Bundaberg, Sunshine Coast & Gold Coast. These workers included youth workers, counsellors, school nurses & health workers who are often the first point of call for young people coming out & as such important providers of information. As an awareness exercise at the beginning of each workshop we gave them a short quiz to complete. One of the questions regarded the age of consent laws in Qld. The overwhelming majority of participants didn't know or were misinformed. Many thought they were the same for gays & heterosexuals; those who thought they were different weren't sure on the ages; those who got the ages correct didn't realise it only related to anal sex. Very few professionals knew what the laws actually were. This is somewhat concerning as these are the people who are called upon to provide information to young people.
Tim Klein
timklein@mailbox.uq.edu.au 15th August 2000
Dear John,
Sorry to read you're so disheartened - I should have responded to this myself by now, so apologies. But nonetheless, I agree that an awareness campaign re the age of consent is required and desirable, but what I think a campaign such as this would (and should) highlight is the homophobic double standard that exists in terms of the unequal ages of consent in Qld. I think this is the point on which more awareness, and ideally a campaign specifically geared towards lobbying to equalise the ages of consent (all at 16, I think), is required. However, consider this a message of support for your concerns.
Stephen Scott
sscott@quac.org.au 15th August 2000
Should accurate information about legal sexual activity involving 16 and 17 year-old persons be readily available &/or accessible to the general public?
The simple answer is YES, of course it should.
The government has a primary role in society to increase awareness of various aspects of our culture.
They do more than just collect taxes.
If the act of sex with a young person is potentially illegal - then everyone who may find themelves involved need to know the risk.
Andrew Petersen
15th August 2000I agree with every thing you said, I also believe, as you have found out,
that the issue is a political hot potato.
Where to next?
Darryl Murray
dmurray@fpq.asn.au 15th August 2000
I'm writing re the the laws concerning anal sex in Queensland and the differing age of consent in comparison to other consenting sexual activity.
The differing age of consent clearly reflects homophobic prejudices on the part of the Government of the day and is totally unconscionable.
I am in full support of measures to provide thorough education and information on sexuality to everyone regardless of age. Such programs should most definitely make people aware of the differing age of consent provisions so that they can then make informed choices.
Not to make such information available only exacerbates the homophobic underpinnings of the current age of consent discrepancy.
If the Beattie government is truly concerned with rights of people the very least it can do is ensure that the age of consent laws are explained to people in a way that enables informed choices and does not foster homophobia.
Even better, the Beattie government should remove this prejudicial blight on the legislation and reform existing laws on consenting sexual activity such that there is a single age of consent for all. Preferably such reform should reform the laws along European lines so as to empower adolescent people in the expression of their sexuality. Such reform would also serve to heal some of the social scars that result from pervasive social homophobia.
Michael Carden
m.carden@mailbox.uq.edu.au; http://student.uq.edu.au/~s101014 15th August 2000
Am I missing something here? The age of consent in Qld for anal sex is 18 for males *and* females. As I understand it, there is no distinction based on sexuality or gender. The perception that it is discriminatory is based on an assumption that without anal sex, gay men can only sit around playing canasta or something. :)
I'm told that anal sex is a not uncommon activity in the str8 community also, but they face the same legal situation as we do. If you want to play with 16-17yos, don't poke them there in Queensland, do "other things". Play canasta if that's all that comes to mind! ;)
Andrew Jackson B.App.Sc.(Comp.) J.P.(Qual.) MACS
andrew.jackson@tequinox.com www.tequinox.com 15th August 2000
I strongly feel that information about the age of consent should be made clear to the public, and obviously for young gay people out there who are still confused about their legal rights.
To be totally honest, I didn't know the age of consent until I received your e-mail. I'd think that there are many people out there who are willing to perpetuate homophobic attitudes through campaigns of fear and ignorance, and that usually any information promoting safe sex between consenting under 18 partners (straight or gay) are institutionally ignored.
Thanks for the e-mail. Tell me how it turns out.
Benjamin Law
b.law@student.uq.edu.au 15th August 2000
From past experience fighting for law reform in New Zealand initially many older gays were happy to accept an age of consent of 20 would you believe. This confirmed loud & clear that many had short memories regarding what most of us had to endure in our teens & it appears this is still happening! As I said previously if there is so much misunderstanding regarding the age of consent or what can & cannot be done it is long overdue that accurate freely available information be better publicised than appears @ present.
Youth suicide figures here are equally as bad as New Zealand & so many youth have difficulty coping with their sexual orientation and need & deserve our support & presumably this is why the 16 yr old emailed you. As QldQueer is "out" there surely it can be expected all ages will view/communicate & this is a healthy sign & should be encouraged, age is just a number & if younger ones communicate via QldQueer we have a duty to respond positively. If health professionals & youth workers
are unsure of the Qld age of consent laws this is a sad indictment of the current health education system and confirms I feel the typical gay & particularly gay youth apathy that exists.
Good on your response to the 16yr old, did you receive a reply from him?
Keep up the good work,
PS How many can recall their first point of contact regarding their gayness and how they were responded to??
Kevin Baston
westway@one.net.au 15th August 2000
Thank you for your comments that have jogged me into action.
The differing age of consent laws perpetuates homophobia in that it states that homosexuals are deemed not able to make decisions for themselves.
Mind you it is cleverly disguised by the 'argument' that gay youths need to be protected from rampant paedophiles. This is in itself further discrimination of another minority group and another blatant attempt to perpetuate heteronormativity.
I guess I am not saying anything that you don't know and have not already heard or read countless times but it needs to be said again and again and may be the message will get through.
I agree with you when you say it is complacency on the part of the majority of the gay and lesbian community and the voting public at large that allows these anomalies to remain in place.
Your comment about the lack of response to your request is indicative of the situation I have experienced too many times in trying to get discriminatory legislation changed or removed.
I have just completed my Honours thesis at UQ on the need for Qld to introduce anti-vilification legislation. When I first started that project I sent a general email to the Qld Queer list asking for ANY information about the types of vilification that people had experienced. I insisted in that email that the information would be confidential and would not be quoted directly in the dissertation. I received two replies given specific examples however both requested that I did not use the information at all in my thesis. A number of respondants were unsure what vilification was and when it was explained to them, they shrugged it off as being an aspect of the reality of being gay. I need not say more on that!
This lack of response indicates two things to me - complacency and fear.
Complacency is also indicated in the general lack of involvement by the g &l community in political issues and matters that directly effect us, that work against us and that we constantly grumble about. I am often confused and disappointed by this attitude however there is not a lot I can do to persuade others to join the fight. But I know that my personal efforts will make some difference.
It is our complacency that allows groups and organisations that work in opposition to the gay and lesbian community achieving equality that maintains the inequities in society. I noticed in the emails about the
recent lesbian IVF controversey that PM Howard had received very many messages of support and encouragement for his family values stance. This support, although it was not directly stated, can only have come from right wing and fundamental christian individuals and groups who are highly motivated, highly organised and very wealthy with a mammoth support network in the US. But as someone said in one of the emails these people will continue to have their way because no one will stand up against them to expose their concepts for what they really are and very few will face the government in the same ways as these groups do.
I am currently in Toronto, Canada researching the religious right, christian coalition etc for my UQ PhD. I intend to do a comparative study of the activities and strengths of the religious right in both Australia
and Canada. Incidentally public complacency is an issue here also however the population is so much larger that it is not quite so apparent as it is in Brisbane.
Peter Balmer
pb@mail.enternet.com.au 16th August 2000
A belated hand raised in support for education re age of consent issues. I believe the response from "E" came from one of the young guys I have on a small list of "Proud Teens" There is another query from one of these guys on my ICQ message today!
My own work in GLBT support through St Mary's Church is attracting interest from schools and individuals in the Catholic community where this issue is a taboo subject, but one that needs to be "aired".
At least our forums on-line can break the silence of mainstream media and institutions.
Tony Robertson
robertsontony@hotmail.com 16th August 2000
Michael Carden, on the QldQueer email group, added the following response to this statement by Andrew Jackson:
"I would be interested to hear what the laws were prior to the "Goss's homophobia" you mentioned. I thought the history of gay sex laws in Queensland was pretty much a two step thing. Anything male-male was illegal, then the current laws were introduced. What was the time line?"
Michael Carden
m.carden@mailbox.uq.edu.au; http://student.uq.edu.au/~s101014 16th August 2000
I am a 34 year old gay male. I have used the Internet for a number of years now and throughout that time I have had many young gay men (16 to 18) request chats with me. Most of these young men are very sure of their sexuality but are very unsure of many of the details of appropriate sexual behaviour and where they stand legally regarding sexual behaviour.
Due to the near sociopathic level of homophobia within this age group, most of these young men are frightened to express their sexual feelings or to seek any information regarding homosexual behaviour or homosexuality in general. The Internet provides a safe level of anonymity for many of these young men to express their feelings and seek information, however as you would be aware, many of the contacts and much of the information available on the Internet is far from safe or reliable. I have helped many young people come to terms with their sexuality and have provided as much appropriate information as I can. I am not a professional councillor nor am I a legal expert, so the information I provide is limited. I have however provided a safe environment for many young people to discuss these issues and I have been thanked on many occasions for my help and the feeling of relief it has provided.
The high level of peer homophobia amongst young gay people has caused a great deal of isolation and vulnerability. As a result there is a raving hunger out there within the young gay community for support and information. This often worries me as the Internet is full of people that don't have young gay men's needs as a primary concern. The quality of information, support and contact offered by these people can be harmful to extreme degrees.
I feel there should be a reliable source of information and support provided in all forms of media, especially the Internet as many young people feel a considerable amount of security through anonymity when using the Internet. The legal age of consent for various forms of sexual behaviour is especially a confusing issue with many young gay people. If this information was provided by the government, many people would feel safe relying on it. Safe, reliable and supportive information is imperative.
So far I have targeted young gay men between 16 to 18. This is because this age group seems to be the most vulnerable and insecure about the whole sexuality issue. There are however a considerable amount of older adults in a similar situation. There are many men who have sex with other men (or are at least considering it) that don't "come out" about their feelings until quite a late age, or have already come out but for similar reasons I mentioned above, have not received reliable information. A Government gay information network should be available and even targeted towards young people, it should also be available and marketed to all gay men at all age groups.
I have not gone into any detail in regards to nature of this information network as much as I have identified the need for it. I am however willing to discuss the details of this much needed information network if required.
David Lennon
david@4zzzfm.org.au 19th August 2000
Yes there should be accurate information to the General public about the age of consent laws.
Which should be accessable to those in direct need of the information: TEENAGERS.
And the most likely place to find this information is in the Public and Private High Schools in QLD and the
rest of Australia. It is our responsibility as Adults to be informed about the laws that involve `our' children so that they know where they stand if they get into a situation where they're unsure of the law; and also our responsibility to inform the younger Generation of our support for their rights of sexual freedom.Scot
starfireblu@windsor.net.au 22nd August 2000Using the
www.whquestion.com website, with the following question, I received some interesting replies from overseas as well: "In Queensland (Australia) the age of consent is 16, but in 1990 the Government introduced a Sodomy law banning anal intercourse for all persons under 18. Most of the public mistakenly thinks that means all sex between men is illegal until 18 years of age. The Government doesn't see this as a problem. Should accurate information about legal sexual activity involving 16 and 17 year-old persons be readily available &/or accessible to the general public?"(posted on 08/07/00 01:19:59 EST)
Wykan answered: Yes. All laws -- on ANY subject -- should be easily available for examination by the people on whom they are enforced.
(posted on 08/07/00 01:36:47 EST)
lysdexia answered: That's an easy one, since it's at www.ageofconsent.com.
(posted on 08/07/00 02:48:16 EST)
deptydog answered: Im gonna have to agree with Wykan. Any laws on anything should be readily accessable to the people they govern. To have "secret" laws only mkaes it easier for a Government to do as it chooses. I firmly believe that it is the Governments duty to keep its citizens informed of laws, changes in laws, and the method of enforcement of those laws. Just my thoughts...
(posted on 08/07/00 03:10:07 EST
stankohls answered: In a democracy, all laws must be widely known and understood. Voluntary compliance is an essential component of the legal system in a free country.
(posted on 08/07/00 05:05:22 EST)
nelson answered: I think in general all governments want kids to wait until they are older to have sex. It seems stupid to allow kids to have sex, but not one kind. Personaly I think all kids experiment with different kinds of sex. Maybe they all went to school in Arkansas like President Clinton, where blowjobs and handjobs aren't sex. (just good communication techiques).
Joking aside, all people should be aware what is legal and not. Where I live 16 is the age of consent, but, if one of the partners is more than 5 years older than the other it is statutory rape. I have seen some people in deep trouble over perfectly normal relationships.
(posted on 08/07/00 07:19:41 EST)
Pete answered: Naturally it is the right of any general public to have all information readily available and accessible!
Any democratic society has to bild on the public access to any legal document or legislation for the public to read, understand and comply with. Democracy also means that if the public are not pleased with the legislation they have the right to elect new representatives to try to change the wording of the legislation.
If the public access is not guaranteed, how would you then defend that this decision has been taken in a democratic manner?
Secondly, a personal comment; If the age of consent is 16, why was this particular act banned by law? And I assume that anal intercourse is also illegal for men/women under 18. Can the law be inforced, if they both (men/men and men/women) consent? Who would check? Are we back to the Peeping-Tom society in Australia again.
(Lived in Australia - Melbourne, until May 1990, and noticed that some states legislation are more Peeping-Tom oriented than others)
(posted on 08/07/00 16:13:51 EST)